She served the American people for 35 years. Now her retirement income is on the line

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After working at the Social Security Administration for nearly 35 years, Michele Santa Maria opted to take early retirement fearing she'd be fired as part of the Trump administration's mass layoffs. Now Congress may eliminate a key part of her federal retirement package.Ariana Drehsler for NPRhide caption

Michele Santa Maria was 18 and a year out of high school when she landed a job at the Social Security Administration's field office in Chula Vista, Calif., in May 1990.

She started out answering phones and sorting mail. From there, she worked her way up to customer service, helping people resolve problems with their payments or get new cards. Later, she learned how to process all kinds of claims — retirement claims, survivor claims, family claims, disability claims.

Eventually, she became a claims technical expert, training others and working on complicated cases. She says the work was hard, and the antiquated computer systems added to the tedium.

"It's a thankless job sometimes, but we're going to stick it out because we believe in what we do," says Santa Maria. "And yes, we want to get to that finish line."

The finish line being retirement. The government's formula for retirement benefits is complicated, but typically, federal workers who have put in at least 30 years can retire at age 57 with their full pensions.

"It was the reason why I stayed so long," she says.

But now, Congress looks to be chipping away at those benefits. A provision in the version of President Trump's"Big, Beautiful Bill" passed by the Houselast month would cut deeply into the retirement income she's been counting on.

"It puts me in a really bad situation," says Santa Maria.

Federal employees across the country perform complex, critical work that Americans depend on. The jobs are not the most exciting, nor the best paid. Still, many federal workers stay for decades, in part because of the government's retirement package, which far outpaces what most companies provide.

The Federal Employees Retirement System, known as FERS, is often described as a three-legged stool. It includes a pension, a Thrift Savings Plan akin to a 401(k) and — like nearly all U.S. workers — Social Security benefits.

In addition, those who retire before they're old enough to collect Social Security can receive a special retirement supplement between the ages of 57 and 62. It's a portion of what they'll be eligible to receive at 62, meant to be a financial bridge for those five years.

That supplement would disappear under the House-passed bill. Federal employees who are younger than 57 on Jan. 1, 2028 would be out of luck.

"I was in shock," says Santa Maria. "I thought to myself, 'There's no way they're going to do this to us.'"

Like so many federal workers, Santa Maria's career was thrown into upheaval after Trump took office.

She had not planned to retire until she turned 57. But fearing she'd be fired amidTrump's massive government overhaul, she took an early out.

As part of the downsizing, the Social Security Administration offered her a $20,000 voluntary separation incentive to retire at age 53. Her last day was April 19, just three weeks shy of her 35-year mark.

"Nobody knew anything. Management didn't know anything. Nobody really knew if your job was safe," she says. "I thought, better just to take it voluntarily than being forced out."

Michele Santa Maria received a pin from the Social Security Administration after working there for 30 years.Ariana Drehsler for NPRhide caption

Only after she had made that irrevocable decision did she learn of the retirement supplement's impending demise. Now, if the Senate agrees to the cut, Santa Maria estimates she'll lose close to $110,000 over five years, money she was counting on to support her in retirement.

"I just can't understand why at the end of someone's career, they would take that away," she says.

Originally, the legislation moving through Congress included bigger cuts to the government's retirement benefits, including changing how retirement income is calculated. Instead of basing it on an employee's highest three consecutive years of pay, the earlier proposal would have changed that to the highest five. That was dropped before the bill went to a vote.

Earlier permutations of the bill also would have eliminated the special retirement supplement as early as this summer, before the date was pushed to 2028.

"What ended up getting passed was really watered down from the original version," says Rachel Greszler, a senior research fellow with the conservative Heritage Foundation. She has long argued that federal retirement benefits are unnecessarily generous, far outstripping what most Americans get.

She was glad to see the House act on the special retirement supplement, calling it "a pure windfall benefit."

"It essentially gives them access to Social Security benefits long before every other American has access to Social Security benefits," she says.

John Hatton, staff vice president for policy and programs at the National Active and Retired Federal Employees Association (NARFE), says it's hard to calculate how many people would lose retirement income under the House version of the bill. He estimates it could be in the tens of thousands.

"It impacts a lot of people," he says, including many like Santa Maria who are taking early outs now because of the threat of mass layoffs.

NARFE has strongly opposed cuts to federal benefits, calling the clawback of benefits earned from past work "a real red line."

"I find it analogous to if you had a 401(k), and your employer put in contributions toward the 401(k), and they vested it as part of that vesting schedule," says Hatton. "Then after the fact, they start pulling back some of your 401(k) balance because they decided, 'I didn't really want to give you that much money.'"

The White House did not answer NPR's questions about the proposed cut or its impact on longtime federal employees.

Hatton argues that the retirement benefits serve as an important retention tool for the government. But Greszler says the perks may be keeping too many federal workers locked in.

"That might be a good thing if you're retaining the right workers, but it might not be a good thing if you're preventing people from pursuing something that they would be better at," she says, adding that churn in the workforce can be helpful.

Santa Maria disagrees. She says Americans need civil servants who can expertly navigate the government's complicated systems. And that expertise takes years to build.

"If people are going to come in for three to five years, the quality is just — it's not going to be there," she says.

Santa Maria says "the government should keep its promise to us" and not remove retirement benefits for longtime federal employees.Ariana Drehsler for NPRhide caption

Santa Maria, who voted for Trump in the 2024 election, says she'd hoped that hisDepartment of Government Efficiencywould bring technical expertise and upgrades to the Social Security Administration.

"But what they're doing now is just eliminating the people and leaving the rest with the outdated computer system," she says.

And now, with part of her retirement on the chopping block, she's even more disappointed.

"I can understand new people — new hires. People who haven't spent a decade with the government. You can make changes at that point. People have the ability to adjust," she says. "But when you have someone who's been there for 34 years and then just to pull the rug out from under you, that's devastating."

She's shared her concerns with California's Democratic Sens. Alex Padilla and Adam Schiff but knows there's little they can do to stop the budget bill, given Democrats are in the minority on Capitol Hill. Under the reconciliation process Republicans are taking to get the measure passed, they need only a simple majority of votes.

Santa Maria also started a Change.org petition asking lawmakers to grandfather in those who, like her, made the decision to retire based on the promise they'd have the supplemental income at 57.

"Do not betray the public servants who gave decades of their lives to this country," she wrote in the petition.

House votes to kill funding for public media

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Legislation in Congress would claw back two years of funding for the public media system, along with money for foreign aid programs.Bonnie Cash/Getty Imageshide caption

The House of Representativesnarrowly approved legislation Thursday to eliminate the next two years of federal funding for public media outlets.

It did so at the direct request of President Trump, who has accused NPR and PBS of bias against conservative viewpoints as part of his broader attacks on the mainstream media.

The measure passed largely along party lines,214 to 212, with two key Republican lawmakers switching their votes from "no" to "yes" to push it over the finish line.

Thelegislationis the first request by the Trump administration for Congress to claw back money it already has approved through annual spending bills. The bill reflects a list of cuts totaling $9.4 billion that were requested by the Office of Management and Budget. The bulk of the cuts — $8.3 billion — are to foreign aid programs addressing global public health, international disaster assistance and hunger relief.

The remainder wouldslash $1.1 billionallocated to the Corporation for Public Broadcasting (CPB), which distributes nearly all of the funds to local television and radio stations, for the next two fiscal years. By law, that money is supposed to be approved in advance as part of an effort to insulate public broadcasting from political influence over fleeting issues. That spending had been approved by both Republican-led chambers of Congress and signed into law by Trump earlier this year.

CPB, which is privately incorporated in Washington, D.C.,is suing the Trump administrationover his efforts to exert control over its board. CPB, PBS and NPR put out separate statements decrying the vote. Executives from the two networks urged the Senate to put a stop to the legislation.

"Americans who rely on local, independent stations serving communities across America, especially in rural and underserved regions, will suffer the immediate consequences of this vote," NPR Chief Executive and President Katherine Maher said in a statement. "If rescission passes and local stations go dark, millions of Americans will no longer have access to locally owned, independent, nonprofit media and will bear the risk of living in a news desert, missing their emergency alerts, and hearing silence where classical, jazz and local artists currently play."

Similarly, Paula Kerger, PBS's chief executive and president, said the fight to protect funding for public media does not end with Thursday's vote. She said the services provided by public television "cannot be replaced by commercial media."

"If these cuts are finalized by the Senate, it will have a devastating impact on PBS and local member stations, particularly smaller and rural stations that rely on federal funding for a larger portion of their budgets," Kerger said. "Without PBS and local member stations, Americans will lose unique local programming and emergency services in times of crisis."

A coalition of local public media officers, emergency readiness officials, Native American tribal representatives, educators and others had joined with listeners and viewers to lobby lawmakers against the bill.

Support for public media has, historically, been fairly bipartisan. But the idea of getting government out of the business of subsidizing public media has always struck a chord in more conservatives parts of the Republican party, and it has been increasingly resonant in recent years.

The Republican majority prevailed on Thursday with a paper-thin margin, however, relying on the flipped votes of Reps. Don Bacon of Nebraska and Nick LaLota of New York.

LaLota and Rep. Mike Lawler, both of whom represent the suburbs of New York City, have bucked party leadership over the separate issue of whether a new budget would return property tax deductions for pricey mortgages. LaLota could be seen on the floor conferring with House leaders just moments before reversing from "no" to "yes." Lawler's vote was among the last cast.

When House Majority Leader Steve Scalise formally introduced the legislation last week, he said it "codifies President Trump's cuts to wasteful foreign aid initiatives within the State Department and USAID, as well as woke public broadcasting, including NPR and PBS, at the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, which is a business the federal government shouldn't even be in."

Republicans attacked the programs they targeted for cuts in speeches Thursday before the vote. "Don't spend money on stupid things and don't subsidize biased media," Ohio GOP Rep. Jim Jordan said.

Democrats defended public broadcasting as providing essential services. They cited the need for local information during natural disasters and balanced news coverage.

"NPR and PBS are targeted here today precisely because they are so good at delivering the truth," Texas Democratic Rep. Lloyd Doggett said. He pointed to Trump's social media attacks on the outlets, saying, "Trump doesn't want a country of engaged, informed Americans. He prefers those who salute on command."

House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, who has accused Republicans of rubber stamping Trump's agenda despite their own misgivings, held up a doll of Elmo, the Sesame Street character, on the House floor.

"The letter of the day is 'C'. How appropriate because this bill is cruel, and it cuts children's programs all across the country," he said.

After the vote, Rep. Mark Amodei, a Nevada Republican who is co-chair of a bipartisan caucus supporting public broadcasting, condemned the outcome.

"Before we trigger major consequences for our local public broadcasting stations throughout the West and other rural areas, we need more discussion—rather than railroading folks over the East Coast's editorials and indiscretions," Amodei said in a statement. "I agree we must make meaningful cuts to shrink our federal deficit; however, I would be doing a disservice to the thousands of rural constituents in my district if I did not fight to keep their access to the rest of the world and news on the air."

While a handful of Congressional Republicans have joined Amodei in supporting their local public radio and television stations, there is intense pressure on them to side with the president. Heritage Action, a grassroots conservative group, designated the vote on the rescissions bill as the first "key vote" included on their scorecard tracking lawmakers' voting records this session of Congress.

Some of Trump's supporters have been frustrated that Congress has not moved sooner to officially back the cuts recommended or put into motion already by the Department of Government Efficiency or DOGE, launched by Elon Musk. Musk initially vowed to cut $2 trillion from the federal budget, then scaled back to $1 trillion. Theactual amountso far has been a small fraction of the trillion promised. But Musk's imprint slimming down or gutting some federal agencies has already reverberated in fallout in the U.S. and around the world.

Musk's recent departure from the administration and public feud with the president haven't affected the plans of top GOP leaders on Capitol Hill to schedule votes to formally wipe out spending for the targeted agencies and programs. House Speaker Mike Johnson said Tuesday he expected additional votes on rescissions requests based on DOGE's efforts.

After the heads of both NPR and PBS testified before a House oversight panel in March, the speaker argued in a statement on social media that NPR and PBS "have consistently and knowingly betrayed the public trust. Instead of fair and balanced reporting, they routinely ignore facts to advance a far left agenda."

"The American people support the free press, but will not be forced to fund a biased political outlet with taxpayer funds," Johnson said.

Two former Republican lawmakers say that the GOP sentiment toward public broadcasting has shifted over time — from frequent support to skepticism to open hostility.

"I always supported PBS on the rationale that 'just because Barnes and Nobles sold books didn't mean public libraries were no longer needed'," former Oregon Sen. Gordon Smith, who served from 1997 to 2009, tells NPR. "But even in those days, I would admonish my friends in PBS to strive for better political balance. This, they haven't done."

Smith says he gave the same advice after later becoming chief of the National Association of Broadcasters, a trade group to which PBS and NPR do not belong. "Given the size of the public debt and PBS's ability to find other financing and sell advertising, well, they've left themselves vulnerable," Smith says.

Former U.S. Rep. Charles Bass came to office with former U.S. House Speaker Newt Gingrich's big Republican wave. Bass went on to represent New Hampshire's 2nd Congressional District for 14 years.

"The debate over whether to fund public television or public radio networks is more divisive than it was," Bass says. "By that process, it is likely to be more imperiled."

"To some extent it's influenced by the perception that it's more liberal than it actually is," Bass says. "There is a bent to it, but it's not as significant as the commercial networks — Fox and MSNBC on either end and CNN in the middle. They really are."

Bass says public broadcasting stands apart for avoiding commercial priorities. But, he says, technological changes in how people consume media have raised valid questions about the need for federal subsidies.

He says that the shift in formats from music to all news and public affairs talk by many NPR member stations increased content that has proved controversial and attracted scrutiny by critics, especially on the right.

Yet he also says the lines have hardened within Republican ranks toward public broadcasting as cultural warfare has become increasingly important to the party faithful: first with Gingrich, then with the Tea Party, and now MAGA Republicans with Trump at the lead, each of which have sought to present public media as unworthy of taxpayer dollars.

"I would be pondering this seriously. I wouldn't be a lock-step supporter or opponent of public radio or television funding," Bass says. "That's true even though I probably listen to [New Hampshire Public Radio] as a news source more than any other source of news."

Congress created CPB, a private nonprofit entity, in 1967. President Lyndon B. Johnson signed the law making CPB the entity to oversee federal grants to more than 300 public television stations and more than 1,000 public radio stations.

In the early years, there were questions about the federal role for CPB. In 1969, Fred Rogers, the host of the popular children's show "Mister Rogers' Neighborhood,"testifiedabout the benefit of continued federal funding. His defense of CPB was credited with changing the mind of a key senator, John Pastore, a Rhode Island Democrat who had pressed Rogers on the value of public television.

Rogers described themes in his half-hour program addressing children's feelings and offering ways to handle them. He told the congressional panel, "I feel that if we in public television can only make it clear that feelings are mentionable and manageable we will have done a great service for mental health."

Lawmakers from both parties frequently appear on their local public stations for interviews. They participate in debates hosted by local stations during House and Senate campaigns.

But for decades, Republicans in Congress have vowed to defund public media outlets. In 1994, then-House Speaker Newt Gingricharguedfor zeroing out CPB's budget. That didn't advance, but in more recent years Republicans have included provisions in annual spending bills to strip all federal money for NPR and PBS. But these have failed to be included in final versions of government funding bills enacted by presidents of both parties.

In 2011, the GOP-controlled Houseapproved a billto bar NPR from receiving any additional federal funding, but that measure failed to advance in the Senate. Seven House Republicansvoted againstthat bill, including then-Wisconsin Rep. Sean Duffy, who now serves as Trump's transportation secretary.

More recently during years of divided government, GOP leaders had to rely on Democrats to approve must-pass funding bills to avoid shutdowns. The debate over the issue of federal funding for public media became more of a backburner issue. CPB received $535 million for 2025. The spending bill approved with bipartisan votes in the House and Senate and signed by Trump in March approved the same level for the next two years.

Just two months later, Trumpissued an executive orderto block funding for NPR and PBS. And this first effort by the Office of Management and Budget to ask Congress to rescind federal money lumped in public media with foreign aid — two areas the GOP base frequently holds up as priorities Washington needs to scale back or eliminate altogether.

Earlier in the week, Amodei and Democratic Rep. Dan Goldman of New York released a joint statement urging the Trump administration to "reconsider" clawing back money for CPB.

The two pro-public broadcasting lawmakers touted public media's news coverage and its role in communicating during emergencies, and pointed out that rural areas are "particularly vulnerable" if funding is cut.

"Public broadcasting represents less than 0.01% of the federal budget, yet its impact reaches every congressional district," the two noted. "Cutting this funding will not meaningfully reduce the deficit, but it will dismantle a trusted source of information for millions of Americans."

Goldman told NPR that Trump's role in pushing this issue is "100%" making this a tough vote for GOP lawmakers to break with the president. "I think if they looked at the merits of it they would recognize it's essential funding — and public media, independent journalism plays an essential role," Goldman said.

He argued that Trump objects because "independent media that exposes facts that may look unfavorable to him is therefore somehow biased, but the First Amendment protects freedom of the press specifically because the press is an essential form of accountability in our democracy."

Some Republicans have defended their own local public television and radio stations and expressed a willingness to work with Democrats to avoid cuts that would force them to scale back coverage or staffing.

Alabama GOP Rep. Robert Aderholt, pressed by Colorado Democratic Rep. Joe Neguse in a hearing on the bill on Tuesday, said Alabama Public Television "has not been subject to these woke policies that some of these other states have," and suggested he could join a bipartisan effort to continue grants to local stations.

But Aderholt noted "NPR is in a different category" and said most GOP lawmakers have had concerns about the outlet for some time.

Even so, most of the cuts will fall on the local stations, which receive by far the lion's share of the funds. Some of that money makes it back to PBS and NPR in the form of fees to run the networks' programs on the air.

Public television and radio stations have mounted a grassroots lobbying effort to urge lawmakers to oppose the package. The Protect My Public Media campaign says more than 2 million messages have been sent to House and Senate offices. "This support is driven by the deep connections Americans have to their local public media stations and the essential services stations provide to their communities."

The rescissions package now moves to the Senate. Under the rules, it needs a simple majority to pass and must be approved within 45 days of the president sending the request to Capitol Hill. That means if the Senate — where Republicans also have a slim majority — fails to pass the bill by mid-July, the administration would be required to release the $9.4 billion in funding for the foreign aid programs and CPB. Senate Majority Leader John Thune has indicated the Senate would take up the rescissions request soon.

Disclosure: This story was reported and written by NPR Congressional Correspondent Deirdre Walsh and Media Correspondent David Folkenflik.  It was edited by Deputy Business Editor Emily Kopp, Managing Editor Vickie Walton-James and Managing Editor Gerry Holmes. Under NPR's protocol for reporting on itself, no corporate official or news executive reviewed this story before it was posted publicly.

Why there’s an unexpected surge in people claiming Social Security

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Bill Armstrong is among the 62-year-olds who have filed for Social Security retirement benefits in recent months. "I decided I better get in the system before they move that age higher," he says.Tina Armstronghide caption

Social Security retirement claims tend to follow a seasonal pattern each year, and they increase over time with the aging of the population, says Jack Smalligan, senior policy fellow at the Urban Institute.

But this spring, something different happened, he says: an unexpected surge in the number of people applying for retirement benefits.

Between January and May, the number of claims was nearly 18% higher than during the same period last year.

The surge is disconcerting, he says, "because for most individuals, it's financially smart for them to postpone claiming as long as they're financially able to." That's because the longer you wait to claim your monthly benefit,the more it grows.

"The question I have is, are these largely people who were planning to retire like six months from now, who have accelerated by a short period of time?" Smalligan says. "Or are they people who are making a much more fundamental shift in their retirement plans, in terms of claiming years earlier than they had been planning?"

Social Security is financed througha payroll tax. During your working years, you and your employer pay into the system. When you retire, your benefits are based on how much you (or your spouse) paid in and your age. The earliest anyone can claim benefits is age 62, and full retirement isbetween age 66 and 67. Once you reach age 70, the monthly benefit stops increasing, even if you further delay taking it.

So what accounts for the uptick in claims? There are several factors at play.

In a statement to NPR, the Social Security Administration wrote that it had identified "three key reasons" that people are filing claims now: a peak of retiring Baby Boomers;a rule changethat increases Social Security benefits for some people with pensions; and a bump in people who had been collecting spousal benefits re-filing to claim a higher benefit based on their own records.

But there appears to be another big factor among those in their 60s: worries about their economic future under the Trump administration.

A slide from a now-deletedagency operational report in late Aprilshowed significant year-over-year increases in claims by 62-year-olds — the earliest age you can file.

Bill Armstrong is one of them. He lives in Berthoud, Colo., and says he "recently decided it was in my best interest to retire."

His career was in IT, testing software. In recent years he was diagnosed with prostate cancer, was laid off from his tech job, and then weathered the ups and downs of government contract work. By last fall, he was applying for jobs, with no luck.

The November election result spurred Armstrong to consider filing for early Social Security benefits, he says. He worried about the direction of the economy, and his inability to get a job as the federal government cuts staffing and jobs in the private sector get harder to find. And he worried that the government would raise Social Security's minimum retirement age.

"With the election and the impetus ofProject 2025, I thought my career might be over as I know it," he says. "I'm battling cancer, I'm married with a spouse, I'm single income. And I decided I better get in the system before they move that age higher."

The last time Congress shifted the retirement age was in 1983, when full retirement was raised from 65 to 67, a change that wasphased in over decades.

And although Social Security payments are called "entitlements," Armstrong notes that they are earned.

"We all paid into those things. In my case, 42 years now," he says.

President Trump has said he won't touch Social Security. But that's not putting everyone's mind at ease. Armstrong says he knows plenty of other people making the same decision he did.

"We feel like that may be taken away from us, so we better get it while we can," Armstrong says.

The former head of the Social Security Administration acknowledged those worries in a late March meeting thatwas posted on YouTubebut later removed.

In the video, Leland Dudek, who was then the agency's acting commissioner, says to another official, "So what you're telling me is that [the pension rule change] put a strain on us being able to process claims. We have normal seasonal highs that are in that mix as well. And that fear mongering has driven people to claim benefits earlier, because they're afraid they're not going to claim benefits at all."

"Yes, you're exactly right," the official replies.

Karen Mccahey, 66, moved up her timeline once Trump took office.

"I was originally not going to claim until I was like 70. That was my goal. Because then when you claim it at 70, you get, of course, more money," she says. But Mccahey, who lives in suburban Chicago, no longer wants to wait that long.

Karen Mccahey moved up her timeline to claim Social Security once President Trump took office.Karen Mccaheyhide caption

Some of her calculus is rooted in her fears of the Trump administration. She worries about how the administration would respond to another pandemic, and that potential cuts to Medicaid will make it harder than it already is to see a doctor. She used to anticipate living into her 80s, but not anymore.

"I know several people who died during the pandemic," she says. "Plus I know people who are dying left and right of cancer, you know, around my age."

So she figures she might as well get her benefits now: "I really don't need the money, but I'll just put it in the bank."

But Mccahey knows that choice has financial repercussions: Her benefit will be lower for the rest of her life. And while Social Security benefits rise with inflation, money kept elsewhere may not.

Mccahey says her financial advisor always tells his clients to wait until age 70 to file. "And I agree with him," she says. "But not now."

The analysis in late April by Social Security Administration staff found that the uptick in claims was especially pronounced among high-earning 62-year olds.

That's likely because high earners can generally afford to put off claiming until later, when their benefit is higher. So an uptick in claims from this group could indicate that something other than financial need is behind their decision to claim now.

This decision can be even more important for women, who have a longer life expectancy than men.

For each year that you wait, your monthly benefitgrows by 8%, notes Kathleen Romig, who directs Social Security and disability policy at the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities.

"So it's a very consequential decision. It can mean hundreds of dollars every month and many thousands of dollars over your lifetime," Romig says.

Smalligan says there have been very few proposals to raise the early retirement age — and changes like that would be a big deal.

"That would be years in the making before that happens," he says. "I would not be advising people to act now on the basis of that fear. If Congress was to do something like that, they basically always build in a lot of lead time. So a change like that would not be made effective immediately, it would be made effective in five or 10 years from now."

Romig says that she understands why people are anxious. Yes, there are long-term questions about sustaining the current level of benefits. But Social Security won't just go away, she says.

"It's in the law and only an act of Congress can change that," says Romig. "And Congress would be foolish to try to take Social Security away at this point, when it's so important in the fabric of American society."

And, she says, "as long as people are paying into Social Security, then the benefits will be paid out. That's how it works."

Smalligan says while Congress needs to address the long-term funding of Social Security, "there's no reason to think that people's benefits are at risk."

"I don't think people should be claiming early because they think Social Security's going to go away," he adds. "It's a very popular program for beneficiaries, as well as for Congress."

One thing to note: If you do decide to file to receive benefits earlier than planned, and later regret it,you can withdraw your claim in the first 12 monthsafter approval.

You'll have topay all the money back. But you can reapply later to claim your higher benefit amount.

What led the Boeing 787 Dreamliner to crash in India with 242 people aboard?

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The back of Air India Flight 171 juts out of a building after the Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner crashed in a residential area near the airport in Ahmedabad on Thursday.Sam Panthaky/AFP via Getty Imageshide caption

An Air India flightended in catastropheThursday, as Flight 171 crashed into a building in a residential area shortly after taking off in Ahmedabad, India. The Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner had been bound for London's Gatwick Airport. The aircraft had 242 people on board — only one person, a passenger, survived, Air Indiasaid.

Casualties are feared to include people who were inside or near the building the plane struck: a hostel in theB.J. Medical Collegein Ahmedabad.

The tragedy is the first recorded incident of a complete loss of a Boeing 787 Dreamliner, an airliner that had itsinitial flightin 2009.

Surveillance and witnessvideos from the scenesuggest the plane may have been in the air for only around 30 seconds struggling to gain altitude before it descended and crashed.

"It just appears to me that the airplane is unable to climb," former National Transportation Safety Board investigator Jeff Guzzetti told NPR, reacting to videos that apparently captured the moments before the crash. "It was able to take off from the runway and get up to 500 feet, but it just wasn't able to climb after that."

Visuals from a CCTV camera from#Ahmedabadairport shows the London bound#AirIndiaAI 171 flight crashing moments after taking off from the runway on Thursday afternoon.Video: Government officialhttps://t.co/akwbYruxn0pic.twitter.com/8cUteSHZia

Information is still emerging about the crash. Here are some key questions:

Flight 171 took off with 242 passengers and crew on board, according to Air India.

The airline provided a breakdown of the passengers who were on the Boeing 787-8:

169 Indian nationals;53 British nationals;7 Portuguese nationals;1 Canadian national

Air India hasset up two hotlinesfor families and loved ones to call for information about passengers.

Flight 171 was a 787-8, registered as VT-ANB. The aircraft was manufactured in Seattle, Wash., and delivered to Air India on Jan. 28, 2014, according to data from Cirium, an aviation analytics firm.

The 11-year-old jet had accumulated more than 41,000 hours of flying time, and almost 8,000 takeoffs and landings, which is average for an aircraft of its age, according to Cirium.

In the past week alone, the airliner had completed at least 11 international trips, with destinations ranging from Paris and Frankfurt to Melbourne and Tokyo, according to the tracking siteFlightradar 24.

Departing early Thursday afternoon local time, Flight 171 used "the full length of Runway 23 at Ahmedabad," having "backtracked to the end of the runway before beginning its take off roll,"Flightradar 24said via Bluesky.

The Boeing 787-8 is the smallest and oldest version of the Dreamliner series, able to carry up to 248 passengers,according to the aircraft maker. The model's fuel efficiency and long range have made it popular with airlines. While the variants differ in length, all Dreamliners have the same wingspan of nearly 200 feet, Boeing says.

Boeing and Air India have a long-standing relationship, with the airline taking delivery of its first Boeing jet, a 707-437, in 1960, according to India'sMinistry of Civil Aviation.

"We are in contact with Air India regarding Flight 171 and stand ready to support them,"Boeing saidafter the crash. "Our thoughts are with the passengers, crew, first responders and all affected."

It's far too early to know what caused the devastating crash. But aviation experts say they're able to draw some information from watching footage of the plane's brief flight — and point to questions that investigators will likely explore.

Guzzetti says he sees several potential explanations.

"Perhaps the engines were not putting out the amount of power they needed to be putting out," Guzzetti said, "although I don't see smoke or burping or flames coming from the engines. So it could be just a computer programming issue with the engines."

Some aviation experts also noted that the wing flaps on the Dreamliner did not appear to be extended. Those flaps are normally extended during takeoff to help increase lift and lower stall speed.

"They need to be extended a little bit before takeoff," Guzzetti said, "But it might be just very, very difficult to discern that from the video."

The National Transportation Safety Boardsaid Thursday morning via  Xthat the agency will lead a team of U.S. investigators to assist in the crash investigation.

There have been quality and safety concerns about the Dreamliner in the past — but none of the planes had ever crashed before.

Federal regulators grounded the entire 787 fleet worldwide for more than three months afterlithium ion batteries caught fireon two of the aircraft in 2013, leading to smoldering fires in the cargo hold. Boeing had to craft a workaround and created a metal box to surround the batteries to prevent fires from spreading.

There have also been concerns about the plane's carbon fiber fuselage. Last year, a whistleblowersaid he had observed problemswith how parts of the plane were fastened together. The longtime Boeing engineer warned that production "shortcuts" could significantly shorten the lifespan of the plane, eventually causing the fuselage to fall apart in mid-flight.

But Boeing pushed back on those allegations. Engineering executives at the companydefended the integrity of the 787's fuselage, saying they had conducted extensive testing with no findings of fatigue in the composite fuselage.

As for what caused the crash of the 787-8 in Ahmedabad, experts say it could be months or years before a complete answer emerges.

The U.S. will tax tomatoes from Mexico. It could mean higher prices for consumers

npr|oleh

On July 14, the U.S. is set to impose a 21 percent anti-dumping duty on fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico, and the U.S. food industry fears that prices at grocery stores and restaurants will go up.

AILSA CHANG, HOST:Let's talk tomatoes, you know, America's favorite fruit that thinks it's a vegetable. It's caught up in the trade war between the U.S. and Mexico, and higher prices could ketchup with consumers. But Florida tomato growers say that tariffs are necessary. Texas Public Radio's David Martin Davies reports.(CROSSTALK)DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

AILSA CHANG, HOST:Let's talk tomatoes, you know, America's favorite fruit that thinks it's a vegetable. It's caught up in the trade war between the U.S. and Mexico, and higher prices could ketchup with consumers. But Florida tomato growers say that tariffs are necessary. Texas Public Radio's David Martin Davies reports.(CROSSTALK)DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

Let's talk tomatoes, you know, America's favorite fruit that thinks it's a vegetable. It's caught up in the trade war between the U.S. and Mexico, and higher prices could ketchup with consumers. But Florida tomato growers say that tariffs are necessary. Texas Public Radio's David Martin Davies reports.(CROSSTALK)DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

Let's talk tomatoes, you know, America's favorite fruit that thinks it's a vegetable. It's caught up in the trade war between the U.S. and Mexico, and higher prices could ketchup with consumers. But Florida tomato growers say that tariffs are necessary. Texas Public Radio's David Martin Davies reports.(CROSSTALK)DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

(CROSSTALK)DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

(CROSSTALK)DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: It's another busy lunch at Mi Tierra Mexican food restaurant in San Antonio's historic Market Square, and hot plates are hitting the tables. One ingredient present in every order is the red tomato.PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

PETE CORTEZ: Tomato is just about in every product that we sell, whether it's in taco meat, in carne guisada. Almost every recipe has tomatoes. Pete Cortez, chief enchilada officer, CEO of La Familia Cortez Restaurants.DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Cortez says, without tomatoes, you don't have Mexican food.CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

CORTEZ: Huevos rancheros, you know, you don't get the ranchero if you don't get the ranchero sauce that's tomato-based.DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Cortez says last year, his restaurants diced about 200,000 pounds of tomatoes. Every one was grown in Mexico.CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

CORTEZ: The tomato that we're able to get from Mexico is, frankly, superior.DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: And Cortez is concerned about what an impending tariff on the fruit from Mexico is going to do to his prices.CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

CORTEZ: If the cost of tomato goes up by 25%, then people are going to probably start looking elsewhere.DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: On July 14, the United States is set to impose a 21% antidumping duty on most fresh tomatoes imported from Mexico. Dumping, in this case, means Mexican tomatoes are being sold in the U.S. below what it costs them to be produced. Robert Guenther, vice president of the Florida Tomato Exchange, says this duty is different from the Trump tariffs.ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

ROBERT GUENTHER: The reason why this is called an antidumping duty versus a tariff is because that the U.S. government has concluded that the Mexican tomato industry has been dumping tomatoes illegally into the United States.DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Guenther says over 25 years ago, the Department of Commerce ruled that Mexico was illegally undercutting Florida's tomato-growing industry.GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

GUENTHER: They broke the law. They broke the U.S. trade law.SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

SKIP HULETT: So none of this makes sense anymore.DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Skip Hulett is the chief legal officer at NatureSweet, a San Antonio-based company specializing in growing, packaging and selling greenhouse-grown tomatoes, a majority of them grown in Mexico. Hulett says NatureSweet isn't dumping Mexican tomatoes. He asked, how then would they stay in business? And he points out that the investigation into Mexico's tomato imports was conducted decades ago.HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

HULETT: Maybe it did in '95 and '96, but they put up an agreement in place that was – in one form or another, has been there for 30 years to protect the U.S. industry.DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: But during that time, the U.S. tomato industry has been withering. Its share of the U.S. market has dropped from 80- to 30%.GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

GUENTHER: So we've lost farms. We've lost jobs.DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: Hulett counters by saying Mexico growers were able to produce a tastier tomato in high volume using state-of-the-art greenhouse technology. Guenther responds that the Department of Commerce said…GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

GUENTHER: There are no differences between quality, freshness, taste of tomatoes.DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

DAVIES: And Guenther says, based on experience, the 21% duty will not result in higher prices. But Hulett says NatureSweet will have to raise its prices because of the tariff. Tomato, to-mat-o, tariff or duty, consumers might say it's all the same to them, but if it does mean higher prices, they won't be happy. Mexico already isn't happy. The Mexican government has indicated the possibility of imposing retaliatory tariffs on U.S. meat exports, including chicken and pork, if the tomato duties are enacted.For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in San Antonio.Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

Copyright © 2025 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our websiteterms of useandpermissionspages atwww.npr.orgfor further information.

Accuracy and availability of NPR transcripts may vary. Transcript text may be revised to correct errors or match updates to audio. Audio on npr.org may be edited after its original broadcast or publication. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

Asian shares slide while oil prices surge after Israel’s strike on Iran

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Specialist Glenn Carell works on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange, Tuesday, June 10, 2025.Richard Drew/APhide caption

HONG KONG — Markets in Asia opened lower early Friday while oil prices surged afterIsrael attacked Iran's capitalamid the ramping up tensions over Tehran's rapidly advancing nuclear program.

U.S. benchmark crude oil rose by $5.6, or 8.2%, to $73.61 per barrel. Brent crude, the international standard, increased by $5.52 to $74.88 per barrel.

In share trading, Tokyo's Nikkei 225 fell 1.2% to 37,721.63 while the Kospi in Seoul edged 0.7% lower to 2,900.14.

Hong Kong's Hang Seng retreated 0.4% to 23,929.62 and the Shanghai Composite Index lost 0.2% to 3,394.52.

Australia's S&P/ASX 200 drifted 0.3% lower to 8,540.80.

"An Israeli attack on Iran poses a top ten of our global risk, but Asian markets are expected to recover quickly as they have relatively limited exposure to the conflict and growing ties to unaffected Saudi Arabia and the UAE," said Xu Tiachen of The Economist Intelligence.

On Thursday, U.S. stock indexes ticked higher following anotherencouraging update on inflationacross the country.

The S&P 500 rose 0.4% to 6,045.26. The Dow Jones Industrial Average added 0.2% to 42,967.62, and the Nasdaq composite gained 0.2% to 19,662.48.

Oracle pushed upward on the market after jumping 13.3%. The tech giant delivered stronger profit and revenue for the latest quarter than analysts expected, and CEO Safra Catz said it expects revenue growth "will be dramatically higher" in its upcoming fiscal year.

That helped offset a 4.8% loss for Boeing after Air India said a London-bound flight crashed shortly after taking off from Ahmedabad airport Thursday with 242 passengers and crew onboard. The Boeing 787 Dreamliner crashed into a residential area near the airport five minutes after taking off. The cause of the crash wasn't immediately known.

Stocks broadly got some help from easing Treasury yields in the bond market following the latest update on inflation. Thursday's update said inflation at the wholesale level wasn't as bad last month as economists expected, and it followed a report on Wednesday saying something similar about the inflation that U.S. consumers are feeling.

Wall Street took it as a signal that the Federal Reserve will have more leeway to cut interest rates later this year in order to give the economy a boost.

The Federal Reserve has been hesitant to lower interest rates, and it's been on hold this year after cutting at the end of last year, because it's waiting to see how much President Donald Trump's tariffs will hurt the economy and raise inflation. While lower rates can goose the economy by encouraging businesses and households to borrow, they can also accelerate inflation.

The yield on the 10-year Treasury fell to 4.35% from 4.41% late Wednesday and from roughly 4.80% early this year.

Besides the inflation data, a separate report on jobless claims also helped to weigh on Treasury yields. It said slightly more U.S. workers applied for unemployment benefits last week than economists expected, and the total number remained at the highest level in eight months. That could be an indication of a rise in layoffs across the country.

"We believe that were it not for the uncertainty caused by the tariffs, the combined information coming from the inflation and labor-market data would have compelled the Fed to have resumed cutting its policy rate by now," according to Thierry Wizman, a strategist at Macquarie.

The Fed's next meeting on interest rates is scheduled for next week, but the nearly unanimous expectation on Wall Street is that it will stand pat again. Traders are betting it's likely to begin cutting in September, according to data from CME Group.

Trump's on-and-off tariffs have raised worries about higher inflation and a possible recession, which had sent the S&P 500 roughly 20% below its record a couple months ago. But stocks have since rallied nearly all the way back on hopes that Trump will lower his tariffs after reaching trade deals with other countries.

Many of Trump's tariffs are on hold at the moment to give time for negotiations, but Trump added to the uncertainty late Wednesday when he suggested the United States could send letters to other countries at some point "saying this is the deal. You can take it or you can leave it."

On Wall Street, Chime Financial jumped 37.4% in its first day of trading on the Nasdaq. The technology company is trying to be the main financial hub for customers, connecting them with its bank partners.

GameStop dropped 22.5% after saying it plans to raise $1.75 billion by borrowing at zero interest rates, though the lenders could choose to be repaid in the video-game retailer's stock instead of cash.

In currency trading early Friday, the U.S. dollar fell to 143.10 Japanese yen from 143.46 yen. The euro edged lower, to $1.1552 from $1.1590.

Trump’s parade, FEMA phase out, and Warner Bros. Discovery divorces … itself?

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It's … Indicators of the Week! Our weekly look at some of the most fascinating economic numbers from the news.

On today's episode: the monetary cost of Trump's military parade, looks like FEMA could be phased out, andanotherchange to Warner Bros. Discovery.Related episodes:Coyote vs. Warner Bros. Discovery (Apple/Spotify)Gilded Age 2.0? (Apple/Spotify)

For sponsor-free episodes of The Indicator from Planet Money, subscribe to Planet Money+ via Apple Podcasts or atplus.npr.org.

Fact-checking bySierra Juarez. Music byDrop Electric. Find us:TikTok,Instagram,Facebook,Newsletter.

‘Buy now, pay later:’ a replacement for the millennial lifestyle subsidy?

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What makes "buy now, pay later" so attractive?porcorex/dblight/Getty Imageshide caption

It's Been A Minutehost Brittany Luse is in dire need of a new couch.

"I can feel the frame through the padding – it's rough," she said. "I'm not even inviting my friends over because I don't want them to sit on this couch. They deserve better than this!"

But she said every time she finds a nice enough couch online, she chokes when she gets to the checkout page.

"Typing in my credit card number for a $4,000 couch just doesn't feel right. It's just a big commitment," she said.

And every time shealmostclicked "buy," she kept noticing something. Right under the options for a credit card, Apple Pay and PayPal were options that'd let her buy the couch and break her payment down into four installments using Klarna, Affirm, or AfterPay. These companies offer "buy now, pay later" (BNPL) loans.

As theIt's Been a Minuteteam dug into it more, we found out that BNPL is gaining popularity – over one in five people has used BNPLaccordingto the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (CFPB), and most of those users have not-great credit.

"I'd split the user base into two main categories of heavy 'buy now pay later' users: young people and people with poor or limited credit history," said NPRLife Kit'sAndee Tagle, who's reported on this topic. "And the reason for that is because the barrier to entry is a lot lower for 'buy now, pay later' loans than your typical credit card or bank loan."

But when the news broke that Klarna was partnering with DoorDash so customers could "eat now, pay later," there was a lot ofconcernabout the prospect of financing burritos. And after finding out from a LendingTreesurveythat 25% of BNPL users use the loans for everyday purchases like groceries, Brittany wondered about the risks of a necessity like food entering the BNPL universe.

So she called up Malcolm Harris, author ofPalo Alto: A History of California, Capitalism, and the World. He said that's actually not what this is about.

"It's about the delivery itself, not the food; it's that convenience," he said. "We saw the same pattern of activity with hotels and Airbnb, for example, or with like cab companies and Uber and Lyft, for example, where you had big deep pocketed investors who are financing these companies at a loss in order to build up market position and a user base and change people's habits at a really fundamental way into this phone-mediated, always on convenience access."

And after hearing thenewsthat Klarna has doubled its losses in the most recent quarter, compared to a year earlier – due in part to people not paying back their BNPL loans – Brittany wanted to know: are BNPL companies banks, or are they tech companies? How should they be regulated, and how will consumers stay protected?

Well – that's still up in the air.

Harris said that originally, BNPL companies didn't have to abide by some of the regulations that most financial institutions do.

"They call it disruption, right? Disruption is the nice gloss that you put on regulatory arbitrage, because so many of these business models are about continuing a previously existing business model, but dodging the regulations," Harris said.

"So Uber is a great example because Uber, when it was first founded, was called UberCab. And when they discovered that would mean that they were subject to all of these regulations that the cab industry was subject to, their strategy was to chop the name 'Cab' off. If they'd been subject to all the industry regulations, they never could have gotten off the ground. Same thing is absolutely true with Airbnb, which is not a hotel service – hotels are heavily regulated. We shouldn't be surprised to see a regulatory arbitrage strategy from 'buy now, pay later.'"

But last year, the CFPB essentiallysaidBNPL companies are credit card providers. That meant that these companies had to comply with the Truth in Lending Act of 1968. And now, another wrench has been thrown in after Trump came into office.

"Theyissueda new interpretation in May of 2025 saying, 'never mind about that other thing, we're not going to focus on 'buy now, pay later' providers, and in fact, we're looking at repealing that whole interpretation,'" said Harris.

And inthe past, if you did get behind on BNPL payments, it wasn't going to be reported to the credit bureaus. But as of the past few months, Equifax, Experian and TransUnion are trying to change this. So potentially, consumers are approaching a situation with BNPL where if you get behind payments, you could potentially end up with bad credit. And now with changes at the CFPB – they might not have any protections, either.

But the rise of BNPL might also be related to what some havecalledthe "millennial lifestyle subsidy." Some tech companies – like the ones Harris mentioned – were described using that phrase because for a long time, they offered services we already had with a newer, more convenient, and often cheaper model. But their prices have beenrisingfor a while.

"I think Klarna and Affirm and any of these other 'buy now, pay later' companies are really inserting themselves as a solution to this problem of: how do you pay for the rising costs that come with Airbnb and come with Uber? And I think 'buy now, pay later' is a button you can click at the end to make it that much easier to afford those things," said Harris.

Harris said lifestyle subsidies are not new.

"We can look at the Boomer generation, for example, as heavily subsidized: by housing loan subsidies that provided a whole generation with cheap houses that they can own, and government programs of highway building, a whole road complex that they could drive on and enjoy. And we see the whole lifestyle that's built on that, right?" Harris said.

"There was a whole generation that came to understand itself in relation to cars and the highway system, and that was heavily subsidized by the state decision to build that highway system. I don't think we're the Uber generation because we loved taking Ubers, we were the Uber generation because capitalists saw an advantage in investing tons and tons and tons of money in these cab services, and we absorbed that, and it changed our lifestyle."

Who pays for lifestyle subsidies when the bill comes due? According to Harris, it's the consumers who are now reliant on formerly cheap services. BNPL services may help people afford them in the short-term, but more people arehaving troublepaying their BNPL loans back.

If we can't afford Uber or DoorDash as easily anymore – even with BNPL – that might require all of us to rethink the price of convenience (or push us to relearn how to hail a cab, or how to make our own burritos).

As for Brittany, she's going to a store to pick out her next couch – when she's ready to pay in full.

Why I joined DOGE

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Sahil Lavingia (right) was a DOGE staffer at the Department of Veterans Affairs for 55 days. He was sworn in on March 17, 2025 by the VA's Assistant Secretary for Human Resources and Administration / Operations, Security, and Preparedness, Mark Englebaum.Sahil Lavingiahide caption

Sahil Lavingia (right) was a DOGE staffer at the Department of Veterans Affairs for 55 days. He was sworn in on March 17, 2025 by the VA's Assistant Secretary for Human Resources and Administration / Operations, Security, and Preparedness, Mark Englebaum.

What was it like to work inside Elon Musk's DOGE? The cost-cutting initiative promised transparency, but most of its actions have been shrouded in secrecy.

For months, there were reports of software engineers and Trump loyalists entering agencies and accessing sensitive data. DOGE also helped the Trump administration lay off thousands of government workers. NPR reporters have been trying for months to get anyone from DOGE to talk on the record. Now, Sahil Lavingia, a former DOGE staffer assigned to the Department of Veteran Affairs, is speaking.

Today, what drew Sahil to DOGE and what he learned about the inner workings, in a way we've never heard before.

For more on DOGE and the federal workforce:

This episode was hosted by Kenny Malone and Bobby Allyn. It was produced by Sam Yellowhorse Kesler and Emma Peaslee. It was edited by Jess Jiang and fact-checked by Sierra Juarez. It was engineered by Neal Rauch. Alex Goldmark isPlanet Money's executive producer.

Find morePlanet Money:Facebook/Instagram/TikTok/ Our weeklyNewsletter.

Listen free at these links:Apple Podcasts,Spotify,the NPR appor anywhere you get podcasts.

Help supportPlanet Moneyand hear our bonus episodes by subscribing toPlanet Money+in Apple Podcastsor atplus.npr.org/planetmoney.

Music: Universal Production Music – "Two Can Play," "Warm Welcome," and "Better Weather"

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